TL494 schematic by 0xff

Silvio

Well-known member
expressel;15636]I found out that the zener don't provide the neccessary current for the discrete mosfet driver.
Also 470n is not enough for the bootstrap capacitor. I used 10uF


The image is too small to see

You can make an auxiliary winding to support the current needed for the drive circuit, As start up you can use a tip50 transistor or even a mosfet which can regulate the output through the base or gate of the device. This in turn charges a bulk capacitor of say 1000uF. This will hold enough energy for a few cycles until the aux winding takes over to supply this voltage. To make something like this work you need to say start up with a regulated voltage of 12v then putting a diode after the regulator to isolate. Another voltage from the auxiliary will supply say 15v from a 7815 regulator this will will also be tied to the positive of the drive circuit. After start up the voltage will only be supplied from the aux winding and the start up circuit will automatically switch off due to it seeing a higher voltage at the output.

Bootstrap capacitors are rather tricky at times. Too large is no good as it does not have enough time to charge up between each cycle, too small on the other hand will not hold enough energy to supply the needed current to switch the gates. This will also depend on the frequency of oscillation. At over 100Khz you will need to see the voltage and rise time on the gates to see that there is enough energy with the minimum possible capacitance. You must use a good capacitor here possibly polypropylene to avoid premature failure. You can put 2 or 3 in parallel to get the correct value. These take quite a beating and must be of good quality.
 

expressel

New member
- The image is too small to see

Okay -> click here to enlarge <-

I dont know: Will this short circuit protection work because it doesn't sense the current at the high side and it doesn't shutdowns the circuit ?

- You can make an auxiliary winding to support the current needed for the drive circuit, As start up you can use a tip50 transistor or even a mosfet which can regulate the output through the base or gate of the device. This in turn charges a bulk capacitor of say 1000uF. This will hold enough energy for a few cycles until the aux winding takes over to supply this voltage. To make something like this work you need to say start up with a regulated voltage of 12v then putting a diode after the regulator to isolate. Another voltage from the auxiliary will supply say 15v from a 7815 regulator this will will also be tied to the positive of the drive circuit. After start up the voltage will only be supplied from the aux winding and the start up circuit will automatically switch off due to it seeing a higher voltage at the output.

Actually, great idea. Its more simple than using separate aux supply.

- You must use a good capacitor here possibly polypropylene to avoid premature failure.

There will be no explosion if this cap fails.

- These take quite a beating and must be of good quality.

I used the lowest possible quality 10uF electrolytic and it works well :D






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Look what limiter circuit I designed. Its intended to use instead a bulb in series. To supply the supply with limited current.
Its buck converter but with no voltage drop, only current sensing. The IC is UC3842 or UC3843.

The "resistor" labeled "SMPS" represents the experimental supply which we need to test.



See this led driver, the topology is the same but without the diode.
 
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Silvio

Well-known member
I found out that the bootstrap capacitor depends on the mosfet driver.

Yes exactly because of different current output with drivers.

The SMPS current limiter looks good but as for myself I keep things simple and use a bulb
 

expressel

New member
Bulb is not good because you can't test with load. You attach the load, the bulb goes on, you remove the bulb and everything blows.
 
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expressel

New member
I've simulated the circuit:



Im uploading the Multisim files if smb wants to play.
 

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  • 250W_smps_0xff_multsim.zip
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Silvio

Well-known member
Bulb is not good because you can't test with load. You attach the load, the bulb goes on, you remove the bulb and everything blows.

LOL that's what you think. What if I tell you I switch up to 1Kw of halogen lights in series with 200w intervals? If things are stable then they can be removed.
 
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Silvio

Well-known member
@ expressel

I want to add something about the auxiliary winding. If the smps is going to be regulated than the auxiliary winding must have enough voltage at hand to sustain the voltage at low duty cycle otherwise the start up circuit will kick in again and the TIP50 will blow with heat dissipation. To minimize heat dissipation you can feed the TIP50 from a half wave rectifier diode 1n4007 from the AC input. This will have somewhat half the voltage on the collector.
 

expressel

New member
To minimize heat dissipation you can feed the TIP50 from a half wave rectifier diode 1n4007 from the AC input. This will have somewhat half the voltage on the collector.

Yes, good idea.

I guess its time to see all this in practice and see how it works.

Tommorow, if I find MJE13001
 
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Silvio

Well-known member
=expressel Tommorow, if I find MJE13001

Do you really need this high voltage transistor. I guess something with lower voltage capability will also do like 2N5551 or a 2SC945.
 

Silvio

Well-known member
well if that can run continuous than an aux is not needed. Otherwise opt for a separate aux supply and thats it a small buck perhaps.
 

expressel

New member
Do you really need this high voltage transistor. I guess something with lower voltage capability will also do like 2N5551 or a 2SC945.

I needed it because 2N5551 fails and goes short.

Today I tried with MJE13004 (i didn't found 13001) but I met another problem. The high side doesn't work when I supply the high voltage. The impulses start good but after that they shrink and go crazy. I tried with 30V instead 310 and then it work.

See the video:

https://youtu.be/rJpion6drfw

I hope somebody knows what is the problem. I thinked very much and didn't succeeded.

Silvio, do you have a Viber? Give me your phone number.

This is the schematic I tried today:

 
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Silvio

Well-known member
You are going in too much trouble. Listen carefully. If you have a high current drive the aux must be also strong, You will be better off with an external auxiliary supply especially if the smps is regulated.

What is happening in your setup is that the voltage is ok in the beginning but then it seems to deteriorate after a while. That means that the aux circuit is not maintaining this voltage, It could also be the case that you do not have total isolation between high and low side drive. This could be disturbing the TL494. Use also some decoupling capacitors around the low voltage supply rails feeding the drive.

What is a viber?

I am sick at the moment with flu and have a bad cough.

Regards Silvio
 

Silvio

Well-known member
I guess something is getting hot. That tells you that the boostrap cap is not charging enough.

give a small load at the output to widen the duty cycle
 

expressel

New member
You are going in too much trouble. Listen carefully. If you have a high current drive the aux must be also strong, You will be better off with an external auxiliary supply especially if the smps is regulated.

Im using a 15V 1A (which gives 20V) adapter for aux. I think its enough.

It could also be the case that you do not have total isolation between high and low side drive.

What this mean?

Use also some decoupling capacitors around the low voltage supply rails feeding the drive.

I used.

What is a viber?

You dont know ? You dont have ? A text messaging program for Android phone.

I am sick at the moment with flu and have a bad cough.

Thats bad but dont worry :)

Regards Silvio

Regards
 

expressel

New member
I removed the feedback for now, this is the maximum duty cycle.
I tried with different bootstrap capacitors from 10n to 10uF
 

Silvio

Well-known member
Quote Originally Posted by Silvio View Post
It could also be the case that you do not have total isolation between high and low side drive.

we usually use a gate drive transformer. Or Half bridge mosfet driver etc.

For comunication we can use watsup do you have it? Or messenger on facebook
 
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